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Blinky
Stall Holder Blinky's Lures Joined: 14 Nov 2011 Location: Darwin. N.T. Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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Posted: 10 Aug 2015 at 2:26pm |
Having previously done some testing many years ago and with the talk about testing twisted wires on Facebook I got to thinking about doing another test.........rigged up two blocks of WRC, one with a wire at each end and the other with a pinned bib (Polycarbonate and brass pin) one end and wire the other. I was very, very pleased with the results............the bib failed (omega clip pulled through ) at 92 kg, on the other block one wire failed (pulled out) at 135 kg...........Here's a photie of the set up I used.
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horrorhead
LureLovers.com Fanatic LureLover of the Year 2020 Joined: 14 Jun 2011 Location: Cooktown qld Status: Offline Points: 14008 |
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I know someone who did a similar test, but he also tested the screw in eyes. The small ones failed (opened) at 120 pounds (about 52 kgs) and the large ones (opened) at 190 pounds (about 85 kgs). Ain't no fish going to pull that hard - unless you are chasing New Guinea black bass. But then you wouldn't have the gear to pull them in. When you consider that Marsha Bierman stand up short strokes using 50 pound line and has caught over 300 blue and black marlin and thousands of bill fish. I don't see a problem in using properly glued in screw eyes.
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Martin-
you don't havta be pretty to fish |
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Blinky
Stall Holder Blinky's Lures Joined: 14 Nov 2011 Location: Darwin. N.T. Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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Dead right Martin. Even at the lowest load of 92 kg I'd be more concerned with other gear failing rather than the Omega Clip pulling...........
It should be mentioned that these tests where conducted with me pulling on a chain block.......if I'd done them under lab conditions the forces applied would have been much greater. |
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Ducks
LureLovers.com Fanatic Joined: 24 Feb 2012 Location: Point Clare Status: Offline Points: 2139 |
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I'm quite surprised that the omega "folded" before the poly bib. That's quite amazing I think!
I'm just wondering if eyes pulling out on a straight pull is really a significant concern for many people? (I've obviously not followed whatever discussion you referenced from facebook) 90 kilos of direct pull force would pull your boat backwards (assuming you had drag screwed down and the worlds strongest man on the job - otherwise it would you out of your boat and water skiing!)... I've only heard of eyelets pulled straight out backwards twice. And it was on the same model lure, by the same fisho (and in the same session). So pretty confident they came from the same run of lures. My assumption was the maker mixed a bad batch of glue, or got distracted and didn't glue properly in part of one single batch - as generally they had a great reputation. I think more lures fail when you have weird angles applied to the connections (ie. timber breaking and eyelets coming out of the lure not the way they went in.) I assume a lot of peoples opinions on eyelets is based around seeing broken balsa lures. There must be a huge difference between a through wire pulled sideways out of a balsa minnow - and seeing an eyelet tear through some solid cedar. |
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Blinky
Stall Holder Blinky's Lures Joined: 14 Nov 2011 Location: Darwin. N.T. Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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When the Omega Clip failed I drilled a hole through the bib in the area where the Omega slot is and continued on with the test, the bib went to around 180 kg before it was ripped in two, the tear initiating at the drilled hole of course.
The glue and brass pin were still in tact, didn't budge, there were no signs of distress on the timber either, which was great to see. My main concern was with the integrity of the glue/pin combination of bib security....... |
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horrorhead
LureLovers.com Fanatic LureLover of the Year 2020 Joined: 14 Jun 2011 Location: Cooktown qld Status: Offline Points: 14008 |
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The test I was referring to was on a straight pull with a block and tackle and a set of scales in the line up. But yes on a weird angle that would be different, mainly depending on the strength of the timber (type, thickness) and the thickness of the eyelet (screw eyes or wire or whatever).
I have had those tiny little eyes on Heddons Crazy Crawlers pull out, but they were not glued in - just screwed in and they are very small with little bite from the thread.
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Martin-
you don't havta be pretty to fish |
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Blinky
Stall Holder Blinky's Lures Joined: 14 Nov 2011 Location: Darwin. N.T. Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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Yep, plenty of variables........if my twisted wires are good up to 135 kg then I'm OK with that.
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Nicho
Stall Holder Nichos Maulers Joined: 25 Feb 2010 Location: POMONA QLD Status: Offline Points: 8752 |
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You read stuff all the time...through wires are necessary, bibs must be screwed, rtc etc.generally from those that have no idea.
only time it happens is like ducks said, error by the maker from being too busy and mixing correctly...rushing. line will break any day before a lure....unless as mentioned above the maker has made a simple error. Jas |
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Nichos Maulers Homemade timber lures....THEY CATCH FISH!
YA DONT KNOW...IF YA DONT GO...SO GET OUT THERE AND... FISH IT |
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Davent
LureLovers.com Fanatic Joined: 01 Jan 2012 Location: Darwin Status: Offline Points: 2227 |
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great test, ive done a heap of tests, and the weakest of my lures were through wired. the wire didnt fail, however, the through wire pulled from the lure in places.
The glued twists did NOT fail at all.
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Atheism is a non prophet organisation
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Blinky
Stall Holder Blinky's Lures Joined: 14 Nov 2011 Location: Darwin. N.T. Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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Just carried out a test with newly acquired 30 minute Zap Z-poxy.
Test block was a piece of WRC with a 0.9 mm x 30 mm twisted stainless steel wire eyelet glued in one end and a 1.6 mm x 30 mm twisted stainless steel wire eyelet glued in the other end. The wire orientation was longitudinal with the grain. Both were glued with 30 minute Zap Z-Poxy and left to cue over a four day period. The 0.9 mm wire eye began to elongate at 102 kg and pulled out of the timber at 118 kg, there was no rotation, the wire tore timber and glue on it's exit. The 1.6 mm wire did not deform at all. Dynamics were not taken into account as the medium the lures operate in is water and will cushion most dynamic effects other than the most savage of initial strikes. With these results in mind I am more than happy to use Z-Poxy as an alternative to 24 hr Araldite. I see that a fair number of guys use Etex, West System and the like as an adhesive, I'd be very interested to see the results of any tests conducted on these types of epoxy.......... TEST SET UP DISPLAY AT ELONGATION 0.9 mm WIRE EYE AT POINT OF ELONGATION JUST PRIOR TO FAILURE 1.6 mm WIRE EYE AFTER TEST |
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Ducks
LureLovers.com Fanatic Joined: 24 Feb 2012 Location: Point Clare Status: Offline Points: 2139 |
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Sweet.
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horrorhead
LureLovers.com Fanatic LureLover of the Year 2020 Joined: 14 Jun 2011 Location: Cooktown qld Status: Offline Points: 14008 |
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Got to be happy with that
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Martin-
you don't havta be pretty to fish |
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Blinky
Stall Holder Blinky's Lures Joined: 14 Nov 2011 Location: Darwin. N.T. Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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Prepared a piece with both end twisted wire adhered with Etex. Results of testing to come.
Also waiting on the arrival of BSI epoxy which I hope to use as an alternative to 24hr Araldite, will do some testing on that as well. |
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beer-breath
Unverified New Member Joined: 19 Apr 2015 Location: British Columbi Status: Offline Points: 453 |
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perfect timing on this. I spent last night putting in my twist-eyes with epoxy. prior, I had simply put in the bought eye-hooks that are threaded and the eye is just a bent-closed loop. I've never had an issue with them, but, I find they are a little too large gauge for my liking, I don't really like the bent-closed eye, and twisting my own is that much more enjoyable and personal for my homemade lures.
now for my type of fishing, this is pretty Skookum. i'm not dealing with any open-water beasts or anything. but, it does give you confidence, knowing that your lure is built-to-last. awesome test, thanks. |
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beer-breath
Unverified New Member Joined: 19 Apr 2015 Location: British Columbi Status: Offline Points: 453 |
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here's something that has bothered me with the local lure-makers over here. they simply use those threaded bent-closed eyehooks. that's fine, but then they go and put them in the lures AFTER they have finished them, top-coat and all. they then screw them in, often not even centered. and the real kicker, is that when someone then complains about their lure not swimming properly, they say that the user/buyer may have to "tune" the lure to get it's action proper. they say you will have to take some pliers and twist the eyehook one way or the other while testing it beside your boat.
that is ridiculous to me. certainly not acceptable for a manufactured, expensive lure. THEY, the maker, should be ensuring "their" lure has it's proper action before it is packaged. this was one of the reasons I started making my own. and there are 3 companies now doing this, 2 of them just started up in the last couple years. these are all interior companies, the coast/island companies use the hole-through design or the solid steel loop formed through and inside the lure. and both those companies lures are molded plastic as well, and designed as salmon plugs. but these more local companies even try to suggest that their lures are for off-shore as well. i just think it's pretty silly to suggest that loosely screwed in eyes are adequate for huge, powerful fish. but, people are buying them, so who am i to know better. |
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rodsncods
LureLovers.com Fanatic Joined: 27 Nov 2011 Location: somewhere Status: Online Points: 4206 |
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if their lures hold up, all well and good.(dosn't sound like they would on a big strong fish). if they don't, word will get around and that will be their down-fall. no point in shitting in your own nest!!!!!!......mick
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BEER IS PROOF THAT GOD LOVES US AND WANTS US TO BE HAPPY!!!
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Blinky
Stall Holder Blinky's Lures Joined: 14 Nov 2011 Location: Darwin. N.T. Status: Offline Points: 741 |
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Etex failed at 74 kg, no elongation, just pulled out clean, no tearing of timber or epoxy sticking to the wire, came out as clean as a whistle. I would not be using Etex to anchor wires/bibs, I feel the 74 kg that it hung on for was quite generous. Then I guess it's not an adhesive epoxy........
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puglee62
Stall Holder Fugly Lures Joined: 03 Feb 2010 Location: ipswich Status: Offline Points: 7933 |
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thats true,mind you your not likely to use 74kg's of drag either
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that's no how ye make porridge!
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